24th January 2008

“Love life, not the afterlife; it stands to reason.”

Ian S. Fielding

42 Responses to “24th January 2008”

  1. Thunder Says:

    The basic flaw in this quote is that of the insinuation that afterlife is not referring also to life.

  2. Nefari Says:

    The critical flaw is the assertion of an afterlife, of which there is no objective evidence.

  3. Mr. Janson Says:

    So, you have to be an atheist to love life?

  4. Nefari Says:

    Well, now that you point it out, that certainly seems to be the logical conclusion.

    OK. That’s done. Let’s take on stem cell research now.

  5. Thunder Says:

    * The critical flaw is the assertion of an afterlife, of which there is no objective evidence. *

    The only critical flaw is in your mischaracterization of religion. Nowhere in religion (let`s not pretend we aren`t talking about christianity) does it say to neglect life. That is your misconceptions through your intentional ignorances.

  6. Thunder Says:

    * Let’s agree – mortality stinks. *

    This is not a shot! Mortality or morality?

  7. Nefari Says:

    That there is no afterlife is one of the big bitter pills of atheism. I’d love the comfort of a resurrection or reincarnation myth. However, I have to reject it. It’s the price for intellectual honesty.

  8. Thunder Says:

    * It’s the price for intellectual honesty. *

    The adoption of the title atheism is not the product of intellectual honesty.

    * I’d love the comfort of a resurrection or reincarnation myth. *

    Science has absolutely NO explanation for consciousness. The dismissal of what can`t be understood seems more primative than modern. It is an overriding tendancy to claim the body as the self but the true value of being is ignored even in the evidentual garden of tombstones which is the end of the body after the consciousness goes to where we can only be told while entraped in physicality.

    * However, I have to reject it. *

    I see no such necessity. Aamof I see that we each to the person practice death and resurrection every day. Sleep is a mystery as is life as is death. Not specifically part of my faith (scripture says little of it) but to me sleep is a built in promise of life after death.

  9. Renshia Says:

    What… no afterlife…..sure their is…. you die… and after that that is after your life…
    now for people like thunder, the thought of sitting around up in heaven stroking the ego of a god.. halaluya….. probably sounds good.

    gees just the thought of that makes me want to wretch…. sitting around forever stroking GODS ego… at least the muslims offer me 72 wives…

    Christianity is so dence… do you guys not have any concept of forever…

    p**K me…. what a horrid picture. Makes hell sound interesting if nothing else.

    “(let`s not pretend we aren`t talking about christianity)”

    Just like all you religious folk.. always thinking it is you who carry the cross. Your wrong thunder we are talking all religions… ALL… your just to narrow in your thinking… if we talk to you we may center on christianity, for your convenience, but when we say it is stupid, narrow, and delusional we really do mean all religion.

    And yes religion does teach not to respect life. it may not say it in those exact words, but it teaches it none the less.
    and you can deny it, but it is only true in your world.. because your to deluded to realize it’s otherwise.

  10. Renshia Says:

    “but to me sleep is a built in promise of life after death.”

    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAH.

    If this is what you constitute as evidence, you must be way denser that we all expected.
    Come on thunder, use your brain just a little. Do you not have even one iota of common sense? is your perceptual concept really so corrupted by your religious dogma you can’t think intelligently, or are you really just so desperate that you need to cling to something as stupid as this to to find reenforcement to support your delusion.

    every time you post something the corruption of your mind become clearer… thinking it is right does not make it so…. if their is no evidence, do you really need to create such crap to support your thinking… the straws are going to break thunder and your world of reason will crash…

    next thing you too will be killing your childeren because GOD told you to….
    if you keep up this farce.

    GET HELP before it is to late.

    I do not know if you have a wife and kids, but their lives may just depend on it.

  11. Renshia Says:

    JUST TO HELP YOU OUT….

    What Determines When We Sleep?

    A major reason why humans sleep is due to circadian rhythms, also known as the biological clock. A cycle that lasts 24 hours is called circadian. Some physiological functions that are circadian include body temperature and certain hormone secretions. So too, humans have a natural cycle of approximately the length of one day.

    Small structures in the brain called suprachiasmatic nuclei (SCN) coordinate circadian rhythms. The SCN, in turn, is very sensitive to the presence or absence of light. This may explain why daytime sleep has been found to be less restful than nighttime sleep.

    Sleep and wakefulness alternate, usually between night and day, respectively. For most people, sleepy peaks occur every 12 hours, at night, and around mid-afternoon. Through a complex process of hormonal and neurological changes, daylight naturally triggers periods of wakefulness. Studies have shown, however, that the absence of light does not disable our biological clocks.

    The longer a person stays awake, the more sleep he or she requires; thus, the need to sleep accumulates throughout the time of wakefulness. This regulation is called homeostatic because it allows the body to reverse the effects of sleepiness by sleeping.

    Sleep Cycle 8Normal peaks of alertness occur during daylight hours. The mid-afternoon dip, called a postprandial dip (after lunch), is caused by a natural decrease in body temperature. When our body temperature begins to drop, we are sleepier than when it begins to rise.
    Why Do We Need Sleep?

    Sleep is not a waste of time. Although researchers are not exactly sure why we need sleep, there are two basic theories:

    * Restorative – Sleep enables the body and mind to rejuvenate, reenergize, and restore. As a person sleeps, it is thought that the brain performs vital housekeeping tasks, such as organizing long-term memory, integrating new information, and repairing and renewing tissue, nerve cells and other biochemicals. Sleep allows the body to rest and the mind to sort out past, present, and future activities and feelings.
    * Adaptive – Sleep may have evolved as a protective adaptation-finding food in the daytime and hiding at night is easier. Nearly every animal sleeps to some degree. Thus, it only makes sense that predators sleep more than animals that are prey. For humans, the amount and quality of sleep achieved is directly proportional to the amount and quality of the next day’s productivity.

    not much mystery there, but then again… maybe it is not true.. I noticed there are not religious quotes in it…LOL

  12. Renshia Says:

    here is a little more, just to help you out…

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/science/humanbody/sleep/articles/whatissleep.shtml

    nothing in there about afterlife…lol

  13. Thunder Says:

    * If this is what you constitute as evidence *

    You mean consider? The other sounds really out of phase. Nothing I said could reasonably be construed as me attempting to be authoritative. I slipped up and said something human to folks who lack any humanity toward me.

    * Come on thunder, use your brain just a little. *

    Is that how much you use yours? I`m not into impersonations.

    * are you really just so desperate *

    The only desperation I detect is yours. I`m perceptive enough to recognize when someone who has been dispatched thinks they see an opening they can exploit to exact a pound of flesh in retaliation.

    * to find reenforcement to support your delusion. *

    I don`t need tactile reenforcment to support my position. You won`t see me looking for Pauls coffin or the ark of the covenant or the egyptian army at the bottom of the red sea or noahs ark. Don`t need it.

    * GET HELP before it is to late. *

    Again you don`t know something you pretend to.

    * JUST TO HELP YOU OUT…. *

    Don`t need your help. I said something intuitive. You know only fleshly matters. You know NOTHING of the spiritual. The levitical laws pertaining to blood and food didn`t elaborate on the practicality of those laws. It simply dictated not to do them. The understanding of why has become clear with the understanding of blood born deseases and food infested parasites. Your antipathy to the very notion that sleep could have the spiritual application of symbology convinces me more there is something to it. Your first and third posts iggy except for this response to the third one. I`m not unaware of the scientific studies on sleep. I`m a chronic insomniac so I have looked into it. In fact there was a study at vanderbilt I was looking into but I`m not sure if that study is still in progress.

    * I do not know if you have a wife and kids *

    And I would never tell you anything personal.

  14. Nefari Says:

    I have a friend who is terrified of the prospect of personal annihilation. So he finds comfort in opium and no longer has to think about it. That is intellectual dishonesty.

  15. Critic Says:

    Religious folk use the promise of an afterlife to entice and compensate.

    The enticement is obvious: obey our laws and you get to heaven. This is great for enforcing their power over their fellow humans. See the christian right, especially the dominionists, as a good example.

    The compensation is that your suffering will be rewarded in heaven. Just keep on tithing and making babies who will grow up to be tithers and suffer along in your miserable existence. God will hand out a reward after you die.

    Science has absolutely NO explanation for consciousness.

    As is usual, Thunder is a dunder head. Here he is invoking the, ‘God of the gaps,” strategy in his typically desperate attempt to find some morsel of sanity in his untenable position. Science DOES have an explanation for consciousness: it is the sum of the chemical reactions that are occurring in our brains. Nothing more and nothing less (well, it might be less in Thunder’s case). Nothing mystical, just plain old everyday chemistry. When the chemistry gets upset, you have mental illness (T-dawg?). When the chemistry stops you are dead. No soul floating to heaven or hell. Just rotting flesh. Makes perfect sense and who would want it any other way?

    More importatnly, who would think up such a silly ideas as eternal life, human souls, etc? Oh, I know, illiterate Stone Age philosophers recently descended from animists. Not the source of ideas that I care to put forward as explanations for existence in the 21st century.

    Critic

    “You’re STUPID! STUPID, STUPID, STUPID, STUPID…..” Thunder the Desperate, 1/22/08

  16. Nefari Says:

    Primitive minds and lazy thinkers have always found it convenient to explain something with god(s) when its true nature was not yet understood. However, that has had a poor track record (weather, electricity, eclipses…) and eventually science gives a more satisfying explanation. I am optimistic the trend will continue with consciousness and personal identity and experience.

    Also, the state of sleep and the state of death seem to be distinct enough to allow very little induction from one to the other. The few similarities are offset by a multitude of dissimilarities both in known causes and ultimate effects. This Platonic argument is neither original nor compelling.

  17. Nefari Says:

    *Religious folk use the promise of an afterlife to entice and compensate.*

    Agreed. This is characteristic of a death cult. Manipulation of believers in life with unsecured promises of a fictitious afterlife. In some ways it’s actually brilliant, as the duped have no recourse once it is time to collect since they are dead. Such activity is nothing short of exploitation.

  18. CaptainZero1969 Says:

    Thunder – “The levitical laws pertaining to blood and food didn`t elaborate on the practicality of those laws. It simply dictated not to do them. The understanding of why has become clear with the understanding of blood born deseases and food infested parasites.”

    Can you elaborate about which strictures you’re referring to? I know there WAS a theory of why Jews abstain from pork but that was long ago discredited by careful anthropology. So, curious what other tidbits of wisdom culinary wisdom are lurking in your cookbook.

  19. CaptainZero1969 Says:

    *Religious folk use the promise of an afterlife to entice and compensate.*

    Heaven’s Gate anyone? Jonestown? Hell, Masada? If you were a medieval serf, your ONLY source of hope was provided by the death cult.

    “Religion is the only thing that keeps the poor from murdering the rich.” Napolean

  20. Thunder Says:

    * I have a friend who is terrified of the prospect of personal annihilation. So he finds comfort in opium and no longer has to think about it. That is intellectual dishonesty. *

    Its ironic. But my example more amply exemplifies intellectual dishonesty. Critic provides another instance of intellectual dishonesty when he proclaims science does have a satisfactory explanation of consciousness. Stating it stipulates that a confluence of chemical reactions explains it. That is him( or whatever) elevating supposition to the pedistal of fact. That is absolutely dishonest.

  21. Renshia Says:

    ” You know NOTHING of the spiritual.”

    and neither do you.

  22. Thunder Says:

    * Here he is invoking the, ‘God of the gaps,” strategy in his typically desperate attempt to find some morsel of sanity in his untenable position. *

    That`s news to me. The statment to which you are referring is devoid of any implied or direct reference to God and religion. It is a lament pertaining to a glaring irononic situation we face in life as we plant bodies because of the departure of conscience.

  23. Thunder Says:

    * and neither do you. *

    I speak about what I know and don`t fall into the trap of being outed because I pretend to know more than I do.

  24. Thunder Says:

    * and neither do you. *

    You can`t know. I, however, address directly your choice of argument.

  25. Renshia Says:

    ” That is absolutely dishonest.”
    there is nothing quite as dishonest as you using fact and twisting it within your religious construct to support your delusions. If you feel happy with doing that then live your life as you must. but to come here and vomit up your concepts to us really does reflect to us the horrid self delusion you have imposed upon yourself.

    if there is a god how is it that a GOOD Christian can become so warped as to believe that God has told him to kill his family…. WHERE WAS YOU GOD THEN. How could he allow this to happen…. why did he not show himself to that guy and say “HEY.. thats not me.

    You know why not… because he doesn’t exist… it is these delusions that unhinged his mind and will unhinge the rest of you to a degree… look at yourself. is is obvious you are on the verge yourself. BEWARE thunder it is only a small step to the abyss.

  26. Renshia Says:

    I read something once that explained religion better than any other explanation i have ever heard .

    Thunder if your mind is not to corrupted and you are able to read this.. I hope it helps…
    this is an excerpt from the book.

    “The audience understood then that religion was an improper response to the divine. Religion was an attempt to pin down the divine. The divine was eternally in flux, forever moving shifting shape. That was it’s nature. It was absolute true enough: absolutely mobile. Absolutely transcendent. Absolutely flexible. Absolutely impersonal. It had it’s god and goddess aspects, but it was ultimately no more male or female than it was star or screwdriver.
    It was the sum of all those things, but the sum could never be chalked on a slate. The divine was beyond comprehension. To say the divine was creation divided by destruction was as close as one could come to definition. But the puny of soul, the dull of wit, weren’t content with that they wanted to hang a face on the divine. They went so far as to attribute petty human emotions (anger, jealousy, et cetera ) to it not stopping to realize that if God were a being, even a supreme being, our prayers would have bored him to death long ago.

    The divine was expansive, but religion was reductive. Religion attempted to reduce the divine to a knowable quantity with which mortals might efficiently deal, to pigeonhole it once and for all so that we never have to reevaluate it. With hammers of can’t and spikes of dogma, we crucified again and again, trying to nail down to our stationary alters the migratory light of the world.

    Thus since religion bore false witness to the divine, religion was blasphemy. And once it entered into it’s unholy alliance with politics, it became the most repressive force that the world had ever known.”

  27. Critic Says:

    That`s news to me. The statment to which you are referring is devoid of any implied or direct reference to God and religion. It is a lament pertaining to a glaring irononic situation we face in life as we plant bodies because of the departure of conscience.

    Talk about intellectual dishonesty. Just read everything that good old Dunderhead writes when trying to backpeddle his way out of a logical conclusion.

    Here’s a another fine example of his idiocy:

    to me sleep is a built in promise of life after death.

    How quaint.

    I bet the Stone Age writers of old Thunder Thigh’s scripture were just as amazed by the “mystery” of sleep. There is no mystery of sleep. It is a well understood chemical process. He really should go out to the library and read a book. It could help him in his understanding of the world in which he is wasting oxygen.

    But, I suppose that chemistry is beyond his ken since it was not ever mentioned in the “scripture” that he seems to be so enamored with. What kind of fools would rely on an ancient text consisting of campfire stories made up just when humans were learning to talk. I think the answer is Thunder.

    Critic

    “You’re STUPID! STUPID, STUPID, STUPID, STUPID…..” Thunder, brother of Ogg, 1/22/08

  28. Chris Says:

    The bible is the revealed word of god. I just wish he’d had more to say about preventing malaria. Still waiting on that list of culinary restrictions…

  29. Critic Says:

    The bible is the revealed word of god. I just wish he’d had more to say about preventing malaria.

    Also, it would have been helpful if he had given the value of Pi to say 50 decimal places. Afterall, god should know a bit of geometry having singlehandedly constructed the universe. The concept of Pi could have been used to the advancement of his minions.

    Oh well, just another cock-up by the big baby-killer in the sky.

    Critic

    “You’re STUPID! STUPID, STUPID, STUPID, STUPID…..” Thunder, Preeminent Scholoar of Stone Age Thought, 1/22/08

  30. Thunder Says:

    * Talk about intellectual dishonesty. *

    There is NOTHING dishonest in my reply to you. The document is in front of you. Read it again if you can read at all.

    * Just read everything that good old Dunderhead writes when trying to backpeddle his way out of a logical conclusion. *

    There is no backpeddling. There is only you typically misrepresenting and me calling you on it.

    * I bet the Stone Age writers of old Thunder Thigh’s scripture were just as amazed by the “mystery” of sleep. *

    As I stated they hardly mention it. Not much material to found your allegation. Lack of material never stops that shit hole under your nose.

    * There is no mystery of sleep. It is a well understood chemical process. *

    Yeah, you are a chemist. You know everything. Lock up the labs and go home. No reason to do anymore research. We already understand it.

    * But, I suppose that chemistry is beyond his ken *

    I have not suggested a knowledge of chemistry. If I do or not does not indicate a lack of intelligence. Pretending to know it if I didn`t would. To call me unintelligent because of your supposition about my lack of knowledge of chemistry would tag any and all who do not know it by disinterest unintelligent. The prevailing subject is not chemistry. The prevailing issue is if science and religion conflict. I say they don`t. I have never run into a situation where I have had to discount one because of the other.

    * since it was not ever mentioned in the “scripture” *

    I`ve already responded to that.

  31. Thunder Says:

    * This Platonic argument is neither original nor compelling. *

    I wasn`t trying to be origional. Edgar allen poe was one who alluded to the apparent similarity in his writtings. I wasn`t trying to make any suggestion other than the vanity of fearing it.

  32. Chris Says:

    Thunder – Dinner is in, like, 5 hours and I’d like to know what foods god doesn’t want me to eat. Can you help? I have a Jefferson bible and he cut all that stuff out.

  33. Nefari Says:

    *I wasn`t trying to be origional. Edgar allen poe was one who alluded to the apparent similarity in his writtings. I wasn`t trying to make any suggestion other than the vanity of fearing it.*

    I’m not familiar with Poe making the comparison. Is this in one of his stories? Correspondence? If you can find the reference, I’d be interested in knowing. Thanks.

    In Plato’s Phaedo, Socrates gives four arguments justifying an afterlife. One of them touches on the analogy of sleep and death. It’s the weakest, but in my opinion, one of the more interesting.

  34. Thunder Says:

    * Is this in one of his stories? *

    I`ll go one better. I couldn`t remeber the specific work so I did a search and came up with this:

    http://www.quotegarden.com/sleep.html

    You`ll find more than one making that comparison including shakespear.

  35. Critic Says:

    >blockquote>You know everything. Lock up the labs and go home. No reason to do anymore research. We already understand it.

    I am sure that we have 100s to 1000s of more years of reasearch ahead of us. My point is that we don’t need is some idiot like Thunder looking for god in every little corner of science in his vain attempt to justify his pitiful religious beliefs. Only a religious nutjob would try to put mystery and divine powers into what are largely understood natural processes. Of course, “Thunder” and “nutjob” are now synonymous in my mind.

    The prevailing issue is if science and religion conflict. I say they don`t. I have never run into a situation where I have had to discount one because of the other.

    Spoken like a complete idiot or a total liar. Or maybe both. Science negates religious beliefs and the very reason for religion. It has been doing so since the enlightenment and will cotinue to do so. If he has not changed his mind on religion based on scientifc fact, he is rationalizing away the contradictions to preserve his religion. A tried and true method of the total fool.

    A simple example for a simple mind: We now have germ theory so we can toss out demon possession as a reason for disease. Except not Thunder – he is still a believer in demon possession based on previous posts.

    I’m sure Dunderhead would NEVER discount his religion for anything. You can count on that. Fanatics never waiver. And, he is a true fanatic. No matter what scientific evidence is put before Thunder, he will never concede a micron on his religious beliefs. That makes him a good xian but the kind of human being capable of suicide bombing and other forms of carnage. Beware the religious mind it is sick, demented and evil.

    Critic

    “You’re STUPID! STUPID, STUPID, STUPID, STUPID…..” Thunder, Suicide Bomber of the Mind and Rationalizer Extraoridinaire, 1/22/08

  36. Critic Says:

    I just saw this from yesterday. Much more eloquent than my attempt above. Definitely bears repeating.

    Terence Meaden Said:
    January 24th, 2008 at 0:17

    “The notion that people will give up irrational beliefs when presented with solid evidence is itself an irrational belief, unsupported by the evidence.” George Lakoff

    Thanks Terence.

    Critic

    “You’re STUPID! STUPID, STUPID, STUPID, STUPID…..” Thunder, The Irrational, 1/22/08

  37. Chris Says:

    Thunder – you’re not making it easy on me. I’m sure you could just rattle these off. It’s going to take forever for me to get my cook book in order.

    “And the hare, because he cheweth the cud, but divideth not the hoof; he is unclean unto you”
    -Leviticus 11:6

    Cud chewing rabbit is OFF the menu. Wait, that can’t be right.

  38. Chris Says:

    Darwin’s Dog! This is gonna be hard.

    “Everything that lives and moves will be food for you. Just as I gave you the green plants, I now give you everything.”
    -Genesis 9:3

    So, eat any damn thing you you please. Great! Then this dick head Leviticus takes back cud chewing rabbits?!?

  39. Chris Says:

    Sorry everyone but this is fun…

    “You may eat any animal that has a split hoof completely divided and that chews the cud.”
    Leviticus – 11:3

    Does anyone know if satyrs chew cud? I hear they’re pretty tasty.

    I’m still trying to find a restriction that looks like, as Thunder asserts, it has anything to do with health and not mere stupid superstition. Help me out here Thunder!

  40. Thunder Says:

    * I’m sure…. *

    Of nothing by your own admission.

    * would NEVER discount his religion for anything. *

    My religion changes all the time.

    * You can count on that. *

    Nothing you say can be counted on. What can be counted on is the mechanism of prejudice that you have adopted.

    * Fanatics never waiver. *

    A mechanism of prejudice. Marginalization. Anyone who would objectively look at that sentence can see that it CAN`T stand as axiomatic. Not because it isn`t particular to fanatics but it is not limited to……

    * And, he is a true fanatic. *

    A conclusion drawn on prejudicial misinformation. The motivating factor behind your marginalizing me is my refusal to accredidate your claim to have rebutted (my)/a position that you have not heard. You CAN`T point to one scientific fact that you have brought to bear on my position. You don`t know my position to refute it. You refuse to hear it for fear that it differentiates from your preconceived prejudice. You lack any credential with me specifically if you exhibit an inability to properly discourse.

    * No matter what scientific evidence is put before Thunder *

    You CAN`T construct a response to something that has not been presented or that you lack awarness of….. It`s prejudicial.

    * he will never concede a micron on his religious beliefs. *

    I make concessions all the time but usually not to people because I have spent so much time constructing my position I`m the only one that knows it well enough to detect a need for further clarity. I certainly won`t make any concession simply to invalidate the false allegation when no pertinent argument has been presented that would necessitate a modification.

    * That makes him a good xian *

    You don`t know what you are talking about.

    * the kind of human being capable of suicide bombing and other forms of carnage. *

    Lewd hypocrisy. Sounds like the run up justification for a holocaust.

    * Beware the religious mind it is sick, demented and evil. *

    …..so eradicate it?

    * A simple example for a simple mind *

    What this exemplifies is your continued attempts to impose a position you will allow me to have. I will NEVER allow you to do that! You don`t KNOW me and you don`t KNOW scripture. You only know your prejudice. I`m not beholden to your preconstructed effigy. It`s easy to punch on a body bag. It isn`t so easy to punch something that punches back.

    * he is still a believer in demon possession based on previous posts. *

    So you see you do know the process though you still insist on your misrepresentations.

    * Spoken like a complete idiot or a total liar. *

    I`m neither. You are both.

    * Science negates religious beliefs and the very reason for religion. *

    I`ve already refuted that with no opposition. Science can`t tell you (why) not to kill. Science can`t tell you (why) not to steal. Etc… Etc…

    * If he has not changed his mind on religion based on scientifc fact *

    You can`t know. You had drawn your conclusions before the discussion. To arrive at that fact would screw with your self-image so you have to swear it off though it is evident.

    * he is rationalizing away the contradictions to preserve his religion. *

    My religion is a pursuit. Science is also a pursuit of mine. Been that way my entire life. I won`t let go of either one. I have not come to a place where I have had to.

    * A tried and true method of the total fool. *

    Even babies are smart enough to hear before speaking but NOT YOU!

  41. Critic Says:

    You lack any credential with me specifically if you exhibit an inability to properly discourse.

    Yoda? Is that you?

    If I ever have any ‘credential’ with T-dawg, I will have lapsed into idiocy and should be heavily medicated.

    My religion is a pursuit. Science is also a pursuit of mine. Been that way my entire life. I won`t let go of either one. I have not come to a place where I have had to.

    An amazing aspect of the human mind is that it can create it’s own reality. I think that must be a good defense mechanism for the overwhelmed mind. There is probably a good explanation of the evolutionary advantages of this capability – I just don’t know it.

    Critic

    “You’re STUPID! STUPID, STUPID, STUPID, STUPID…..” Thunder of the Overwhelmed Mind, 1/22/08

  42. Thunder Says:

    * An amazing aspect of the human mind is that it can create it’s own reality. *

    Yes, you can and you can create your own adversary from your own imagination so you don`t get your hands dirty having to deal with real discussion. It is so uncontrollable what the other person might say that you can`t legitamately respond to.