2nd September 2011

“Christianity may be a peaceful religion these days but a few hundred years ago it was as violent and bigoted as Islam is now.”

Anon.

24 Responses to “2nd September 2011”

  1. Allan Says:

    If the religious right had their way, we would be as violent and bigoted as Islam today.

  2. R J Says:

    oh big deal.

    religions have been doing damage to to human lives for centuries.

    the tools dont matter……fire, swords, bullets, bombs…..it makes

    little difference. the THINKING is the real danger.

    the utter crap that people have inflicted upon each other,

    int the name of god , or righteousness, or whatever, is

    sickening. human beings are the deadliest creatures

    on the planet………..to all life forms………..and especially

    to themselves. religions only fan the flames of

    intolerance and devisiveness. this would be a better, safer

    world if the religions ceased to exist.

  3. CaptainZero Says:

    Wait… are we conceeding that christianity isn’t STILL bigoted?

  4. R J Says:

    capt z……………..

    i dont quite follow you…….

    can you re-phrase

  5. archaeopteryx Says:

    I agree with Allan, RJ and CaptainZero.

    The quotation probably refers to horrors such as the witch trials, the crusades and the inquisition. It probably also includes smaller everyday intolerances that didn’t make the history books but could have affected thousands of peoples’ happiness and peace of mind. Perhaps islam is going through that phase now – and news sources suggest that there are many christians who could revert to that mentality without much prompting.

    I don’t think religion is the primary cause of these problems. I think that they are caused by human nature and the fight for resources. Anything that signals difference between people gives those who seek it an excuse to behave badly. Religion is the one of the major indicators of difference and causes most problems mainly because faith, its major symptom, cannot easily be dislodged from the sufferers’ minds. Religion may even inflame those who would not otherwise do so to behave badly.

    Today, in civilised societies, discrimination on grounds of most other forms of difference such as colour are forbidden and punished when identified. Religion, however, is rewarded by most governments.

    One thing we should hope for is the better education of children, including a refusal to force religious faith on them before they can think. Provide them all with built-in, shockproof crap detectors before they are seven years old. It wouldn’t solve everything, but it would remove a lot of excuses.

  6. Atheist MC Says:

    There are many causes of human conflict, but most of them can be appeased by reason, fairness and compromise even if they do start out as bloody. Religion however is impervious to reason or compromise, all parties are “right” by divine fiat. This is why talking with the Taliban will be futile and reasoning with Bachman, Perry and their ilk is similarly impossible. We can only hope that the Islamic countries which still exist politically and socially in the middle ages achieve their own enlightenment. This won’t eliminate radical Islamism any more than than ours did radical Cristianism, but it may put it back in the bottle for a while.

  7. electrabotanical Says:

    Arch – I love your plan to provide kids with built-in crap detectors before they turn seven. It’s a good idea to try and fool your kids with BS, over-the-top stories and let them figure out that as much as they want it to be true, it’s actually crap. Seven is about the age where kids start to realize that Santa isn’t real and neither is the Easter Bunny or Jesus. Start with really crazy things like “we’re going to the Moon for Thanksgiving” or “I’ll call the Queen and ask if you can be adopted and be a real princess”.

    Let them call you on BS and they will then be equipped to call BS on “You won’t be able to go to Heaven and live with me and Gramma and Jesus when you die if you TOUCH YOURSELF DOWN THERE.”

  8. Sinjin Smythe Says:

    Crap Detector: To protect your kids try GodBlock http://godblock.com/

    At the risk of sounding like a conspiracy theorist I would submit to everyone the following:

    The Confederates didn’t simply dry up and blow away after the Civil War. The Nazis weren’t vanquished from the earth at the end of WWII. These forces continue their agenda from behind a veil, from the shadows.

    Do we not recognize the term “wage slavery” when it pops up today? Do we not recognize the persecution of the Jewish state almost from every direction? Why are Muslims always portrayed as terrorists? (There are a billion Muslims and the CIA says about 10,000 are Taliban)

    There are other examples I could make but I think everyone gets the idea.

    Before I continue, I’m not advocating for anyone but I’m not interested in persecuting anyone either.

    Well like the Confederates, who were actually Christians following the statements in the bible that explain how to treat your slaves, and the Nazis, whose leader stated in Mein Kampf that he was Catholic, Christianity is still actively engaged in the most evil of behaviors.

    It is easy to point out the atrocities when they are boldly and brashly committed without regard for retaliation. Not so easy when they are conducted from behind the veil or from the shadows.

    The media, isn’t it amazing. They talk about things and it shapes our thought consciously and unconsciously.

    Within the collective consciousness of Americans today is the notion that Christianity is peaceful today and it is the evil Muslims that are the bad guys.

    Us versus them. And if us is mostly Christians then it is them dirty Muslims that we’re against. Just flip on the evening news, its there for all to see.

    Except they never show the evil that Christians are actively committing today.

    The difference between the Christians of today and there evil doers of yesteryear is today they are better about concealing their evil ways.

    Sure it spills out of the poorly lit seams at times, the preists hungering for the loins of young men, Mother Teresa counciling young poor third world women to not use condoms, the Pope sitting on a pile of wealth while the indigent masses starve right outside the gates of the Vatican, et cetera.

    You have to admit though, as grotesque as these abominations are, the Christians have mechanisms to sweep this shame under the proverbial rug.

    What you don’t see is the ugliest of uglies.

    Why is it that the news highlights the relationship between the Jews and the Muslims? Are the Christians just the good guys in the middle or does the majority US Christian audience not want to see the Christians in their true light?

    Why would we encourage hispanics to speak their native language in the US? We all know that poverty is ubiquitous with hispanic communities. We all know that Spanish speakers are among the poorest people in the world. We all know that English is the language of business. We all know that many Asian countries are teaching English as a second language in secondary shools.

    I read recently, and you will have to trust me as I’ve forgotten where or I’d provide the link, that in China by 2015 there will be more people speaking English than in the US.

    Why do we promote Spanish language? It is to accomodate hispanics? Or is it to expanding the numbers of our working poor? I mean the ATM doesn’t have a Chinese option, or a Russian option, French, et cetera.

    We have lost our manufacturing edge, not only for jobs going overseas, but for the fact that we only have 308 million people in the country. Why then turn away illegal aliens? Why not recruit them to come here and work? Add to our economy? To compete with populations like China and India we are cutting off our noses to spite our faces by sending the illegals away. We ought to be actively recruiting and patrioting immigrants, teaching them English, educating them, and hiring them. Growing our economy!!!

    Why do we promote the deadly neurotoxin alcohol and then shun hemp, a product that was actively cultivated by George Washington and Thomas Jefferson. Why would the DEA have the authority to classify any substance? Isn’t that the fox in the henhouse? If the DEA ever re-classifies marijuana/hemp what will they do? The only reason they exist is to prosecute unjust marijuana/hemp laws.

    So maybe you think I’ve gotten a little off track. Well I ask you, where else do you see this level of illogic? Think about it. Where else do you see people actively supporting stuff that just doesn’t make sense? Foremost among the who?

    Christians.

    So lets be honest, Christians aren’t any less hostile or dangerous than Jews or Muslims. Religion is what it is, tradition. Science is what it is, progress.

  9. NatureofReality Says:

    All religions that teach an ‘Us & Them’ mentality(is there any exceptions?) are evil for the peaceful cohabitation of this planet with other cultures/people.

  10. R J Says:

    sinjin……………..

    i am a life-long cynic.

    since “it takes one to know one” let me tell you that i very

    much appreciate many of your viewpoints.

    keep up the critical/abstract brainwork kid !!

    it will ALWAYS serve you well.

  11. Sinjin Smythe Says:

    Thanx R j! And Nature I agree completely as you might surmise.

    And now for some comedy:
    Rick Perry’s God
    http://www.slate.com/id/2302661/

  12. Sinjin Smythe Says:

    ‘Oldest’ woolly rhino discovered
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-14754317

    Ah and oh by the way, solly if you are out there, the reason I keep posting evolutionary biology articles is because they are the proof of evolution. There are millions of articles detailing the many multitudes of biological discovery that is evolution.

    Cerainly more information in your silly bibles.

  13. Jeff Says:

    Mr. Smythe,

    As a liberal, the stuff on Rick Perry isn’t comedy – it’s tragedy, as the stupidly (or calculatingly) pious SOB might just pull a Reagan and get himself elected. The last time we played with that turned into a disaster (SEE: the current world wide economic downturn because “Government isn’t the solution, government is the problem”, vis-a-vis financial regulation).

    Sorry, it’s really hard to laugh when my nation is swirling around the toilet drain…

  14. CaptainZero Says:

    Sinjin,
    Thanks for the article from Christopher Hitchens.

    -cz

  15. Sinjin Smythe Says:

    Jeff of course you are correct, and I say that not as a self-proclaimed Liberal, but as a self-proclaimed fiscal conservative and progressive Republican.

    Nothing in my mind could be worse, even President Obama being re-elected, that an idiot nut bag like Rick Perry being elected.

    It is a certain testimony to the poor education standards in Texas that Mr. Perry could have even been elected governor of Texas.

    No need to fear though, at least I don’t think so. President Obama, even given the pathetic lack of leadership he has shown up to this point, is a shoe-in for re-election as the Republican have no plans to field an electable candidate.

    For futher information on the President’s re-election odds:
    http://www.smh.com.au/world/obama-reelection-in-doubt-as-jobs-crisis-worsens-20110902-1jq2k.html?from=smh_sb
    http://news.scotsman.com/world/Obama-looks-to-history-as.6829490.jp
    http://www.financialexpress.com/news/obama-s-re-election/840794/
    http://www.suntimes.com/business/7409732-420/white-house-9jobless-rate-in-2012.html

    I like to think I’m beyond partisanship, we probably all do, and willing to say a member of my own party is a nut bag: Something not all of us will do.

    Reagan was in my mind one of the great presidents. Easily in a league with Kennedy, FDR, and others. I don’t see how we get from 1980 to today without Reagan, but save that for another day. Your post was about Rick Perry and on your point I agree, it is hard to laugh when one thinks about Rick Perry being president.

    I think you will agree were Rick Perry to be elected, government would be an even bigger problem than it is today?

  16. Sinjin Smythe Says:

    Right back at you Captain, Hitch is great. So great to be alive in the time of the Four Horsemen. Wish Hitch wasn’t sick.

  17. Rj Says:

    JEFF…………at post 10:01

    aint it the truth. perry is a wacko……no question about it.

    AND he’s a religious wack………….which is really sad.

    but i dis-agree with you :: i dont think he can get in.

    even with good old god pulling for him !!

  18. Sinjin Smythe Says:

    Oh Jeff, if Rick Perry, Michelle Bachmann, or Mitt Romney is nominated, I like Colin Powell, will be voting for President Obama’s re-election.

    See Republicans for Obama
    http://www.republicansforobama.org/

  19. R J Says:

    SINJIN………………

    hitch is SICK ????????? how ?? what ??

    tell me. this is upsetting news. i gotta leave for a half hour….

    but i’ll get back to you.

  20. Sinjin Smythe Says:

    Facing Death, Christopher Hitchens Affirms Atheism
    http://www.christianpost.com/news/facing-death-christopher-hitchens-affirms-atheism-49977/

    Christopher Hitchens
    http://www.vanityfair.com/contributors/christopher-hitchens

    He is no longer able to speak. So sad to be losing such a brilliant mind.

  21. R J Says:

    SINJIN………………….

    thanks for the info……………….very, very sad.

    the guy is so beautifully articulate. it will be a heartache to

    lose his light.

    well. buck me up, kid. keep your thoughts and posts

    coming. your words will be comfort.

  22. Atheist MC Says:

    Mr. Smythe,

    As a liberal, the stuff on Rick Perry isn’t comedy – it’s tragedy, as the stupidly (or calculatingly) pious SOB might just pull a Reagan and get himself elected. interesting. i have just finished the Monty Python autobiography and one of the final comments is that satire lets us mock but not get angry, hence George Bush. I dont like the conclusion, as I love satire, but it could make sense.

  23. Atheist MC Says:

    Arrgh i hate iPads.

  24. Atheist MC Says:

    Our admin, who art in cyberspace, forgive us our html cock ups Ramen