10th January 2013

“History suggests that the killers were always the truest believers, and that notions of tolerance, peace and enlightenment come from those who question the orthodoxy.”

Michael Coulter

13 Responses to “10th January 2013”

  1. Capt'Z Says:

    Heretic –

    Thanks for the response. I’m not sure what to do with it. It’s just a laundry list of conservative concerns and each one has a substantive response. Take, for example, light bulbs. Electrical power is a finite resource because you can’t just keep building power plants. Lighting consumes about 18% of total energy generation (499 billion kWh) but is one of the most easily modulated due to new technologies coming on line. Yes, the alternatives to incandescent light are more expensive today but the societal costs of letting everyone be free to be horrifically wasteful outweigh the restrictions government imposes to attempt to use the available power more efficiently. And I save on my PG&E bill. Damn you, Obama, you fucking socialist!

    We live in a society, Heretic. Your comments on lighting restrictions make it sound like you don’t know or don’t care that resources are finite. They are, and in our case we elect people we hope will help us allocate those resources wisely.

    Government has never told me what toilet to buy. They set efficiency standards for industry and I get to pick. I have a low-flow toilet. I picked it and it works just fine. How was I harmed? Because the government set standards, I actually save on my water bill. Scary, right? Water is also finite. We in CA are in the middle of a virtual water war because residences are putting the squeeze on water profligate agriculture. We now have a dust bowl in parts of the central valley. In that situation isn’t it obvious to require 1.6 gallon toilets instead of 3.5? Dual flush, even better. Curse you G.W. Bush, you Bolshevik bastard.

    I think we’re just going to have to agree to disagree here. Your sense of aggrievement at being told you have to wear seat belts and that you can’t risk your grandson’s life in the back of a pickup are just common sense to me. I feel quite free, thank you. Must be generational.

    All – I’m really sorry for Heretic and my political digression. Clearly atheism isn’t a monolith!

    Chris

    From yesterday:
    Origin of Teabagger:
    http://www.nationalreview.com/nrd/article/?q=Mjk1YmRjNzIxNmUwMTI0ZWYxZWU4OWU2MzFiOWJmNDE=

    Overtly right wing Christian bagging for Jesus, recently:
    http://blogs.ocweekly.com/navelgazing/2012/02/prayer_breakfast_illegal_immigration_laguna_hills.php

    Calling it a Christian Right movement isn’t just me:

    “The extent of the rebranding was confirmed this week by a new survey by David Campbell and Robert Putnam, the authors of last year’s monumental American Grace. Polling 3,000 people before and after the rise of the Tea Party, Campbell and Putnam identified the two characteristics most likely to turn someone into a Tea Partier: being strongly active in Republican politics and identifying with the religious right. A similar Pew study in February found that 69 percent of white evangelicals agree with the Tea Party.”

    Maher used the term first on or about April 1, 2010.

  2. Bruce Williams Says:

    CVapt’Z, Thanx for the National Review reference. I did not know about the connotations of “TeaBagger”, but I could pick up on the sneer with which it is used and consequently do not use the term myself. Whoda thought?

  3. Bruce Williams Says:

    Oops, Capt”Z not CVapt’Z – sorry for the typo.

  4. The Heretic Says:

    So what the Tea Party people were doing to raise concern for their country and the issue that they hold dear – you use as a vulger slur. The term disgusts me, and quite frankly your usage of it disgusts me. They are people raising alarm that we are the not the free country that we were founded as, as opposed to the nanny state you seem to adore. I guess rationalizing away your rights and freedoms for the ‘greater good’ is something that you are adept at. Well, sir, you may choose to live in shackles, I will fight against it. Government shackles are just as oppressive (maybe more so) as the shackles of religion. Maybe you should rationalize a parallel. Because your rebuttals of why you shouldn’t live free of non-sensical regulation and over-reaching government ignores common sense and thousands of years of government tyranny.

  5. Dan Says:

    TH,
    1. The Tea Party used the term first. Get over it.

    2. Do you really think that Liberals don’t care about the national debt? Evidence shows that the GOP has been growing the Federal Government heck of a lot faster than the Left: http://www.forbes.com/sites/rickungar/2012/05/24/who-is-the-smallest-government-spender-since-eisenhower-would-you-believe-its-barack-obama/

    3. Supply-side economics is dead. Wall Street and Corporate America are doing better than ever, and joblessness is still high. Job creators? HA!

    4. If you seriously think that liberals don’t give a damn about liberties, get a dictionary. Or better yet, just stare at the words liberal and liberties until they start to look vaguely similar. Hint: It’s not an optical illusion!

  6. The Heretic Says:

    Bless your heart, you poor soul.

  7. Dan Says:

    TH,
    Go teabag someone then.

  8. Capt'Z Says:

    My last on the topic..

    So, Heretic, you think government policy designed to encourage conservation of finite resource represents an illegal encroachment by a totalitarian state?

    You also think not allowing parents to risk their children’s lives (riding in the back of the truck) doing obviously dumb things is similarly bad?

    These are fascinating positions. Honestly this looks more like anarchy than libertarian-ism. It’s one of those positions that might look good in theory but I’d shudder to live under in practice.

    Is society to have NO rules in your desired state? Or only those rules that protect your right to do whatever the hell you want? How to handle conflicts between individuals with opposed desires? Guns? I should be allowed to have a strip mine on my property even if it destroys yours downstream?

    If that’s the world you tea partyists (anarchists) want, I oppose you more than ever.

  9. Dan Says:

    Well said Capt’Z.

  10. The Heretic Says:

    I am bemused, but ultimately saddened, that you have no concept of the freedoms that you are pissing away. You have no concept of your history and why these freedoms were paid for with blood. Personal responsibility is a antediluvian concept, apparently.

    One must now have their asses wiped, by the gov’t, from the day they are born until the day they die. How pathetic.

    I don’t need you, or any of your ilk, to tell me how to conduct myself, how to raise my children, how to live, or how to die. I will follow the basic laws of a civilized society. That doesn’t include you telling me what the flush rate of my toilet should be, what car I should drive, nor that the incandescent light bulb is evil. It isn’t. But that cancer-causing replacement is. You can take your hoax of global warming, a giant wealth distribution scheme, and stuff it. I don’t want to wear a helmet to ride a bicycle or motorcycle and it isn’t any of your business anyway.

    The federal gov’t exists to fulfill the roll of : national security, trade, and to secure my basic rights as are enumerated in the Constitution. The states have other mandates, per the 10th amendment: education, infrastructure, police and safety personnel, and a few other items.

    Nowhere in any of that does it say that I need to pay for abortions for unwed mothers, welfare, illegal immigration expenses, sex changes for inmates, or healthcare for people who don’t want to purchase it. Personal responsibility is a wonderful thing. Freedom is a wonderful thing. I am sick and tired of paying for all of the pet projects of bleeding heart politicians that should never been allowed under the Constitution – or under the state gov’ts for that matter.

    I am sick and tired of all of your rules and regulations because you are too vacuous to know that coffee is hot, toasters and radios should not be used in the bathtub, and that sometimes in a game there are winners and (gasp!) losers who may have their feelings hurt. Oh, and once in a while, if you do something really stupid, it will kill you.

    If I want to keep score, I will. If I want to drive a gas guzzling vehicle, I will. If I want to smoke on the porch of my house, I will. If I want to ride my motorcycle without a helmet, I should be able to. It isn’t your business if I let my kids ride in the back of the truck. You aren’t their parents. I am. I am not hurting anyone. And you cannot protect the world from getting hurt from everything. Quit trying. You people can keep your nanny state crap to yourselves.

  11. Digdougdogman Says:

    Now one ever said atheism leads to rationalism did they. Once again I have to point out that “heratic” is a fucking loon! I am sorry, I try my damnedest not to throw around blatent insults, but for fuck sake this person is fucking wacky. Go live in a fucking cave if you don’t want to be part of a civilized society, where we actually look out for one another. This me, me, me bullshit will be the death of humanity.

    Once again I apologize for the language and resorting to insults but I can only read intellectual masterbatorial dribble for so long.

  12. Dan Says:

    TH
    Just as gods don’t exist, so too with free lunches. Get over it: freedom isn’t free.

  13. Bruce Williams Says:

    Soon the government will be expecting us to stop at red lights.