25th March 2009

“Bishops, priests, preachers, imams, rabbis, male or female – they are all professional liars.”

Peter Manchester

11 Responses to “25th March 2009”

  1. Edgar Wing Says:

    Liars? Don’t they believe what they are saying to be true? My guess is that they typically do, at least consciously. To the extent most are lying, my guess is that it is to themselves more than to others. Their crime is willful ignorance more than willful deception.

  2. Please engage brain Says:

    Deluded and manipulative maybe but not professional liars.

  3. Hypatia Says:

    I disagree – The claims they have made to me, especially as a child, were almost always presented as the “truth” as opposed to conjecture, speculation and hearsay. To me that is dishonest.

  4. The Heretic Says:

    Aah, but “truth” and facts are two different things. One can lie about facts. “Truth” is something that is larger than just facts, and often ignores them. “Truth” is the same as a faith or a philosophy. How does one lie about a philosophy? Now, if they peddle their “truths” and deep down know them to be factually incorrect / false truths, then they are liars – to themselves and everyone else.

  5. Larry Huffman Says:

    While I do agree that some are willful liars…as you would find in any cross section of society…I do not think everyone who has chosen the profession of spiritual leader (whatever flavor) is a liar. Most, as others here have pointed out, believe they are telling the truth.

    No…I think this statement is far too strong and incorrect.

    Better to state:

    Bishops, priests, preachers, imams, rabbis, male or female – they are all presenting a bunch of lies as truth.

    This statement at least does not impune their character as much as shows them as deluded. The difference is subtle but marked.

  6. Chris Says:

    How about this rewrite – “Bishops, priests, preachers, imams, rabbis, male or female – many of them sincerely believe the outrageous drivel they shovel down the throats of their all too credulous flocks. The rest are simply cynical liars.”

  7. Larry Huffman Says:


  8. Hypatia Says:

    It’s dishonest to claim something is true when actually it’s a matter of faith.

    Saying that these people have a different definition of truth is simply another way of saying they’re liars.

  9. Larry Huffman Says:

    No it isn’t. being liar implicates them in knowingly spreading falsehood.

    For years people thought the world flat. When someone stated the world was flat before anyone on the planet knew any better…were they liars? Of course not…they were speaking truth as it was accepted.

    Christians accept all that they ‘know’ is true by fiath as real truth. It is not as if people of faith know they are believing something false, but their faith forces them to lie. Not at all…they believe their faith shows them the truth.

    Yes, the entire premise of faith is intellectually unsound…however…those who teach their truths based on faith are not lying because their faith is testifying to the truth of what they are saying.

    So…fault the person for relying on faith rather than reason or logic…but you cannot outright call them all liars. I assure you, most chrisitans that have tried to teach me believe they have the truth…and regardless of how they come by it…they are not actively choosing to deceive, therefore they are not liars.

    It is splitting hairs however…if someone feels better about themselves by calling all chrisitans liars, then so be it. That is not a definition that will sitck…as most of us are more than willing to admit that much of what we know as fact or truth today may be found to be wrong as well…and so we will also be liars using that reasoning.

  10. Oxymoronic Christhinker Says:

    Some “bishops, priests, preachers, imams, rabbis, male or female” are merely amatuer “liars.”

  11. Hypatia Says:

    those who teach their truths based on faith are not lying because their faith is testifying to the truth of what they are saying.

    What utter tripe.

    To represent a faith position as the truth is wilfully dishonest.