19th October 2011

“The reason that Christianity is being 'sidelined' is that few people actually want it in their lives. Atheism and secularism are the results of that, not the cause.”

Terry Sanderson

12 Responses to “19th October 2011”

  1. R J Says:


  2. archaeopteryx Says:

    Mr Sanderson is a reasonable man and I hope he’s right, but I wonder what the evidence is for this statement?

  3. electrabotanical Says:

    Everybody is too busy slaving away their lives all week long to have to get up and dress up on a Sunday. Sunday’s blessing is getting to sleep in late, have a cooked breakfast and read the newspaper. Who wants to muck that up with sin and confession and guilt-inducing fairytales?

  4. archaeopteryx Says:

    As a retired person, my life is a continuous Sunday close to that described by electrabotanical. Bliss!

    But I suspect many god-botherers actually enjoy their masochistic behaviours.

  5. Sinjin Smythe Says:

    Arch you are probably correct for more than just retirees. Electra’s “long week…muck it up” comment certainly fits 47 year old me.

    My parents too. When I was a boy there was a struggle between my devoted presbyterian Grandmother and my rebellious only-child Father over Sunday services.

    My Dad wanted me to play hockey, I did too, I found church to be hell.

    Fortunately my Father was in charge and from 4 years old on I never had to go to church again. What a blessing!

    I found myself in hockey, epic battles, human struggle, and a lot more fun than can be had in a moth eaten, dusty and stinking church.

    The fellowship among my team mates was far more enjoyable than the time spent among the blue hairs praying to empty space.

    I’ll take a Sunday 5:45AM practice over any time in a church.

    That may be the answer to your question Arch, that for at least Presbyterians/Protestants walking away from faith. The news has been reporting for more than a decade about Protestants walking away from faith, and Catholic priests haven’t exactly been covering themselves with glory (they have been spreading something else) either. I’ve read about Catholics walking away from their faith after all the preying upon young boys that is at the heart of what being a Catholic priest is all about. (Catholicism is a false front to mask the institutionalization of pedophilia)

    Call it a renewed enlightenment where people are starting to realize that religion isn’t real. It is tradition sure, but that isn’t enough on its own to make up for the fact that it is all nonsense.

    There is a reason that the smartest people are very rarely religious. Sure your knowledgeable neighbor may be a church goer, but he isn’t the smartest person: He’s average. The smartest people are the Nobel prize winners, the scientists, the authors, the high IQ types, the Mensa.

    Even theologians don’t believe in a literal god:
    The Reason Driven Life: What Am I Here on Earth For?
    Theologian Robert M. Price : http://amzn.com/1591024765

  6. electrabotanical Says:

    I’m not sure I’d go so far as to say that “Catholicism is a false front to mask the institutionalization of pedophilia”, but they definately have that going on in their ranks, and if it isn’t dealt with, it will only get worse. Perhaps that is what you are referring to – the lack of oversight encouraging the sick to indulge. I just think the training and job responsibilities are so extensive that many pedophiles would find it easir to just troll at the local park. But I’m just guessing.

  7. Jeff Says:

    As far as today’s quote goes, the evidence the e.bot requests can surely be found in the steadily decreasing numbers of church goes in the industrial world. Learning (note I didn’t say education, ’cause they a’int the same thing) leads to reasoning which in turn leads away from the church.

    Sinjin, I read your post of yesterday, then this morning, I woke up to the bedroom TV showing Michael Moore’s “Capitalism: A Love Story”. What I awoke to was the film of FDR giving his State of the Union address on 1/11/44 as a fireside chat after he had delivered it to congress earlier that day. It was only the last 10 or so paragraphs, but the lack of cuts, and the back of an FDR aide cutting across the camera as FDR gathered his papers at the end attested to the fact that the film was unedited beyond cutting off the front end, which was mainly on the state of the war. What’s so funny about this is that I started thinking about what you had written, and that’s when it hit me. Sir, please do not be offended by this, but regardless of your registration, you are a true New Deal Democrat. If you think I’m wrong, grab a copy of that speech:


    I strongly believe that you will see exactly what I mean. FDR was really just a pragmatist who kept hunting around until he found an idea that worked, then put the philosophical justification behind it. However, in this speech, he finally laid out the ultimate justification for the New Deal. And when the war ended, a bunch of New Dealers went to the occupied nations and wrote the constitutions under which they live today. Yep, Germany, Japan and Italy all have problems today, but if you really examine them, I think you’ll find that they’re mostly because of folks who want to go back to the Good Old Days, which, even in those societies, never really existed.

    Anyhow, I thought that you might get a kick out of my realization.

  8. Sinjin Smythe Says:

    Also I think people are realizing that the Abrahamic religions have hijacked a great many of the words we use and that people are coming to realize that many of these have definitions beyond the religious. For example:

    Spiritual soul: immaterial, the sense of identity, essence, the soul of intellectual life, emotional or intellectual energy, the embodiment, an individual person, a person, opposed to material or physical things, not concerned with material values or pursuits.

    I think for instance we can all agree the R j is a kindly old soul, an atheist soul, but a kindly old soul just the same.

    You see this yearning in the rise of alternative spirituality and I think it foreshadows exactly what I’m saying and that is, in the case of a spiritual soul one has no need of the supernatural fo be one.

  9. CaptainZero Says:

    Richard Dawkins giving Christopher Hitchens the Atheist Alliance International Richard Dawkins Award at the Texas Freethought Convention.

    The Richard Dawkins Award will be given every year to honor an outstanding atheist whose contributions raise public awareness of the nontheist life stance; who through writings, media, the arts, film, and/or the stage advocates increased scientific knowledge; who through work or by example teaches acceptance of the nontheist philosophy; and whose public posture mirrors the uncompromising nontheist life stance of Dr. Richard Dawkins

  10. R j Says:

    sin at 1652………………….

    did you mean ME ?? why, i’m stunned.

  11. R j Says:


    checked out “the reason driven life”…………

    looks great……………ordered on amazon prime,

    so i’ll have it friday……thamks 4 the tip !

  12. Sinjin Smythe Says:

    Electra I’m just calling a spade a spade. Cases have been documented as far back as the 11th century. I don’t think you need to go back that far to see that the problem of pedophilia in the church is systemic. Just the last 10 or 20 years, where in the media we have gone from the “few bad eggs” line to the International Criminal Court investigating the Pope and high ranking Vatican officials for covering up child abuse. I know “where there is smoke there is usually fire” isn’t exactly conviction but it has been smoking for an awful long time. Sooner or later my false front claim has simply got to be the case. As for trolling the local park you have to remember these people are looking to conceal their activity and appear a part of society. Trolling the local park wouldn’t work for very long.

    Jeff you are correct in a sense, both Ronald Reagan and I were/are New Deal Democrats: Or at least subscribed to a practical progressive sense of public policy.(Pardon the alliteration). The reconciliation of modern day Republicans with their Teddy Roosevelt/Abraham Lincoln progressive nature doesn’t work. And me, with generations of my family Republicans, find it awfully hard to recognize the values I grew up with in the party of today.

    It is a great observation! In terms of my political leanings I’m definately socially progressive and fiscally conservative. Which is to save I don’t want to waste a thin dime on the forward progress of humankind. I do plan on spending on the forward advance of humankind but spending like it was my money and not someone else’s. A wasted dime is a dime stolen from the other needs of our society. For instance: The overkill we have militarily is money that would be better spent on Cancer research.

    Cap’n it will be a sad day when Mr. Hitchen’s succombs to his cancer. I fear it will be very soon. I wish we had some way of thanking him for his good works.

    R j yes you! You kindly old soul! I think you will enjoy the book a lot. The man in perhaps like you, a kindly ole soul.