27th April 2008

“We have just enough religion to make us hate, but not enough to make us love one another.”

Jonathan Swift1667 – 1745

8 Responses to “27th April 2008”

  1. Terence Meaden Says:

    “Within religions, many people love one another—while others hate.

    Between religions many people hate one another—while some love.

    From within religions many people hate non-believers—or see them as potential fodder for consumption into their own.

    But from outside religions, many people are sorry for believers who have been deceived into believing the impossible that religions offer.” TM

  2. Bornagain A. Theist Says:

    TM is correct. Most religions claim to teach love, but the practice of the fundies rarely bares that out. The fact that the former President of the US, George, Sr. wishes to dissolve the very citizenship of atheists is so outlandish that in a more perfected society, it might have been all the grounds needed to impeachment.

  3. Tzuriel Says:

    Wishes and attempts to are very different things, Bornagain (like the name btw). If Bush Sr. had attempted to take away atheists rights (how would you determine that?), then I totally agree with you. Otherwise, unfortunately, we have to keep him around. Of course, currently, the only way to get impeached these days is to have sex, so I guess your rights are screwed, friend.

    Also, I don’t believe in “perfected” societies. Utopianism is about as delusional as it gets.

    And, as usual, people don’t need religions to hate. Heck, they don’t even need other people. They only need themselves. Religions are very obviously not the source of hatred – people are.

  4. Critic Says:

    …people don’t need religions to hate

    True. But, religion makes it much easier to hate, maim, torture and kill since the religious do it in the name of their god – which allows them to fully justify their actions. Religion really is a benefit to those folks, isn’t it. I just don’t know why I ever felt that religion was a bad thing……

  5. Tzuriel Says:


    Religion also makes it a lot easier for people to love. You can’t just consider one aspect of a thing; you must consider the whole thing. Sure, people have done bad things in the name of religion, but they’ve done many good things in the name of religion, too. There’s no doubt in my mind that if you were to remove religion from this world there would be the same amount of violence. It would not go down. People don’t really fight out of religious fervor. They fight out of desperation. Religion only acts as an excuse used by these people; without it, they would simply use another excuse and the problem would never be solved. I respect your decision not to be religious, but to proclaim that is the only way everyone else should be is folly. If you want to stop violence, stop all the killing, maiming, torturing, etc., the way to do it is not to remove religion. It’s to remove desperation and misery.

  6. Critic Says:

    Religion also makes it a lot easier for people to love.

    True. Religion makes it easy to love those of your religion and easy to hate everyone else. So, in a way, I agree with you. Well done.

  7. Tzuriel Says:


    You have an uncanny ability to take people’s words and twist them to fit what you want them to say so its easier for you to defeat whatever “arguments” you come up with. So well done to you, sir. You should be a reporter.

    You know what I meant. Christ told people to love ALL men. Not all Christians actually follow that admonition, but there are many that do. Really, it all depends on the person. If the person has a hateful personality going in, and nothing is done to change that, they will be a hateful person (to members of their faith, too). If they don’t, again with nothing being done to change it, they’ll be a loving person. Many religious people do a lot of good things, regardless of religion. My parents for instance, have been giving to charity all their lives, even doing programs like the one (don’t remember the name) where you support a poor child in a 3rd world country and give him/her an education, a future, somewhere to go with his life, regardless of his/her religion. Amazing how wrong you can be when you’re stooped in your need to vindicate atheist zealots.

  8. Critic Says:

    Amazing how wrong you can be when you’re stooped in your need to vindicate atheist zealots.

    I am not familiar with this usage of the word “stooped.” Care to enlighten me?

    As for the zealots reference, I would have to disagree and note that you seem a bit tense. Perhaps a nice walk among the flowers would help cool you down.