8th February 2010

“If a place can be designated – preferably in outer space – for those who believe they are so holy, their religious 'truths' so absolute, that they cannot cohabit with other faiths then we should all contribute to the creation of a space armada that would shuttle all such purists to that sanctuary.”

Wole Soyinka

30 Responses to “8th February 2010”

  1. solomon Says:

    This guy get carried away by the noble prize he received voted by hypocrates quickly made up lousy quotes on religous groups just to satisfy their masters.

  2. Atheist MC Says:

    I have to half agree with Sol on this one. It’s a trivial sentiment trivially put, and Douglas Adams had already suggested we do the same thing with hairdressers and advertising execs.
    I’m relatively optimistic that that rational thought and secularism will win the day in the end anyway. Fundemental religion is self defeating and essentially doomed. Just a matter of time.

  3. tech Says:

    Praise the Lord! God has already designated a place out there for his people and its going to be a grand place.Streets paved with gold,Gates of Pearl. But come back down to earth Tech. In the meantime we still have to get along ,give people all due respect.We are commanded to love one another, one of the greatest commandments given.

  4. Holysmokes Says:

    Seems like a trivial quote. Although I am sometimes tempted to find a deserted island somewhere and put all fundies, hairdressers and ad execs on it. Hmmm, maybe the Galapagos. Nope, not far enough.

    FYI, gold would make an extremely poor road surface. It’s far too soft.

  5. The Heretic Says:

    Atheist MC, I’d love to agree with you on the thought that –

    ‘I’m relatively optimistic that that rational thought and secularism will win the day in the end anyway. Fundemental religion is self defeating and essentially doomed. Just a matter of time.’-

    …but I don’t. Fact is, they are a lot meaner than we are and their motivation is not rational. Simply thinking they will just go away is far too optimistic. The hard core fundamentalists will turn the concept into a war before that is allowed to happen.

  6. tech Says:

    I’ve been a Christian for 37 yrs,two things I do know and that is. ( 1 )There is a God. ( 2 ) I’m not Him.

  7. tech Says:

    Heretic , there are still some things worth fighting for. Just because we are Christians don’t mean we have to be door mats.

  8. Atheist MC Says:

    Be sure you know what you are fighting for. All most atheists want is a secular society. That is one where government is unbiased towards any religion or none and laws are made in accordance with rational consensus ethics and not according to deontology.
    Secular societies however do not have to consist entirely of secular individuals, quite the contrary in fact, most atheists are perfectly conmfortable with individuals following any religion they want, as long as they are happy with us following none and don’t try and get their beliefs transcribed into law.

  9. CaptainZero1969 Says:

    I agree, MC. I read a persuasive argument by, I believe, Hitchens where he asserts that the reason the U.S. is now the most religious of the modern economies is due in large measure to government non-interference in religion. In places where the government has picked a religion to support, belief has ebbed far faster. This is due to the inevitable stifling that comes from government interference in a matter of conscience. In the U.S., by contrast, religion has been a free market for a long time and as a result there are thousands of brands that allow users to select that which most closely matches their prejudices. I’m not sure this is the result Jefferson desired but there it is.

  10. The Heretic Says:

    As long as they take away their tax exempt status, I don’t care if they pray to an elf lord.

  11. tech Says:

    Any form of prejudice would not be accepted by a true Christian. I don’t know why it seems that the Atheists think that they are a treat to a Christian. I for one certainly don’t treatened.

  12. tech Says:

    Heretic , do you have any tax exemptions.? If so why don’t they take away yours? Some organizations do a lot of good, the burden of tax should not be another concern for them.

  13. Greg Says:

    I think the point of the quote might be missed by some. It’s not really calling for a forced exodus of believers so that the rest of us don’t have to live with them, it’s more of a condemnation of believers who refuse to accept that others don’t agree with them. It’s a condemnation of intolerance, which I happen to agree with.

    For better or worse (worse, in my opinion) we live in a society that allows freedom of religion, which means that any wing-nut with a half-baked idea can use whatever resources they have to attract followers. ItThis is a detriment to society

  14. Greg Says:

    Oops…hit the submit button by mistake. As I was saying…

    For better or worse (worse, in my opinion) we live in a society that allows freedom of religion, which means that any wing-nut with a half-baked idea can use whatever resources they have to attract followers. I believe in freedom of speech just as much as the next person, but better controls are required to prevent predators (i.e.: religion) from taking advantage of those who are easily fooled. Society needs to be less fearful of religion – or more accurately, less fearful of the reprisals and attacks that religion can mount when they face criticism.

  15. CaptainZero1969 Says:

    Tech – don’t misunderstand my use of the word “prejudice”. What I mean is a person’s preconception of their view of god, heaven, morality etc. There is little agreement among sects on a host of topics and people naturally gravitate to that sect that supports their preconceived notions.

    It’s beneficial when a faith tradition forces one to confront their sectarian impulses but sadly this is rare. Nonetheless, look at the schism in the Anglican communion over the ordination of a gay man. Many would rather fragment a church than have their church push them toward greater inclusivity and I’d say, love.

  16. tech Says:

    Whats this about a persons preconception of their views and notions. A society that allows freedom of religion and that any wing nut with a half baked idea attracting followers.Atheists = Communists if thats the way you see it. Everyone is a treat to you. Talking about half baked ideas and wing nuts I think you have you’re share of them.

  17. Oxymoronic Christhinker Says:

    tech: “Atheists = Communists” ? What? Please explain.

    I agree with all those comments suggesting a secular government and no tax-exempt status for church, synagogue, mosque, etc.. I think overall this would be good for religionists (see Cap’n ‘s post) and secularists, though taxing the church, etc… would bring its own issues (regarding representation) to the forefront of our political debates here in the USA. Would a church, etc… have more or less say, ‘legally,’ in public policy by being taxed? I am not talking here about religious ideas – you can’t stop individuals from believing what they will – but religious organizations as organizations. For example, are religious organizations equal to corporations in regards to the recent Supreme Court decision on campaign contributions? If not, would taxing them change this or not?

    Churches, etc… being tax-exempt, just because they are churches, seems unfair to me, but taxing them also seems problematic. Thoughts?

  18. Holysmokes Says:

    Can anyone direct me to a site where questions regarding evolution can be asked and will get answered by professionals in the field?

    I’ve have been discussing evolution with a Christian friend. He insists that life is simply too complex to evolve at anywhere the rate evolutionists claim. He feels that the amount of information/coding required for significant changes in a cell could not possibly account for macroevolution. His questions: Where did all this information come from? How could the vast amount of information contained in a single cell occur by accident? He feels it would take a mountain of precise changes in the way a cell works to even begin making the cell evolve into something different, or useful to the host. The junkyard/tonado/747 scenario.

    Based on science articles that I have read, changing the way a single protein operates/unfolds, appears have a cascade effect on everything downstream of it. As a result, a single protein change can bring numerous changes to a single cell. Also, some proteins are multi-functional, which implies that more changes can come about from a single mutation.

    Our arguement: What he calls “information” I call “physics.” My analogy is a gust of wind sending a small rock down the side of a hill. When the rock collides with another, it causes the second rock to move as well. Was this collision “information” changing hands, or is it simple physics? Obviously several more rocks will be affected down the hill, similar to that of an altered protein in the cell. Are the reactions automatic, or does it take information being passed to correctly construct the cell?

    Some might call this semantics, however if creating life is autonomous physics, then a “designer” need not be required. If it is considered “information,” then my Christian friend may have a point. Your thoughts?

  19. Greg Says:


    You’re putting words in my mouth again. I never said all Christians or religious people were “half-baked” – but some certainly are. Jim Jones, Osama Bin Laden, Pat Robertson, Benny Hin and Peter Popoff come quickly to mind, but there are many, many others. They explicitly seek out the gullible and prey on them for financial gain and power.

    This, in my mind, constitutes a failure in our society to protect the innocent. But because of the “untouchable” status that religion receives in this day and age, one cannot speak out forcefully with reason for fear of being attacked or labelled as “intolerant”. Our right to attack religious thought has been neutered by special interests who support religion “freedom”.

    Turning my attention back to half-backe ideas, however, the evidence to support the existance of dinosaurs and the event known as the holocaust is overwhelming – both are fact. Yet in an earlier post you indicated that you were undecided in regards to your belief in these. Why? My suspicion is that someone who promotes “half-baked” ideas convinced you to believe that they did not exist.

    If you can point to evidence to suggest otherwise please bring it forward.

  20. The Heretic Says:

    Tech, please explain to me why you think a church should have a tax exempt status. They may do good, but it is usually what is good for themselves and their followers. That is not a charity, that is a club. They garner much wealth by being tax exempt. Have you ever seen the Vatican? Why is it that in every small town, the best land (most expensive and well placed) has a church on it? Lessee, maybe cuz these organizations are cash cows. Maybe, as they give back to community, they can give to our federal government also – LIKE THE REST OF US.

  21. brighter future Says:

    Good luck “discussing” with someone who is a “true-believer”, but you can read this from the national academy of sciences:
    I’d contact a local community college professor of anthro. or biology and pose the question.

  22. solomon Says:

    Evolution cannot explain everything. Creationism on the other hand explains everything.The processes that is going on in what they termed as evolution are being mistaken as evolution.Its only a process outlined and determined by God.
    What is termed evolution for example cannot explain other happenings that is going on. How an artist possess the talent in playing a guitar or composing a song for example.How the chef creates countless dishes that favors our taste buds.How the hairdressers or advertising execs did an excellent job in their owm field of profession.All this can be easily explain in a simple manner when we know all of these talents are gods gifts.
    The word creationism introduced by god is full proof, cannot be refuted.Whereas the termed evolution is weak and can be refuted in many ways.
    There are many other events that the word evolution cannot explain, our dreams for example. Who determines the episode in our dreams?The thoughts, love, fear, hate?How do evolution account for that?

    EVOLUTION=or similar to only a WORD.

  23. Holysmokes Says:

    Thanks Brighter Future, I’ll take a look.

  24. Greg Says:

    It’s unfortunate that some people will never fully grasp the basic fundamentals of Darwinian evolution. Others seem to willfully choose to remain ignorant about it.

  25. solomon Says:

    Its not a question of ignorant anymore. Its the criucial questioning of reasoning.

  26. solomon Says:

    Indeed, the worst of living creatures in the sight of Allah are those who have disbelieved, and they will not [ever] believe –

    Surat Al-‘Anf?l:55

  27. solomon Says:


    Surat Al-’Anfal:55

  28. Greg Says:

    Quoting scripture to prove the existance of god is no different than quoting the Lord of The Rings to prove the existance of Gandalf.

  29. brighter future Says:

    Gandalf doesn’t exist?! Shattered I am.

  30. solomon Says:

    That were the true words of the Lord.Can’t you feel it strikes you straight to your soul.